The forecasters have been going on about cold, lack of stormy weather and the like for an age now.

But it hasn't been that cold has it? I mean, there's been some cold nights, notably in the Somerset levels & Thames valley, but overall http://www.met..reading.ac.uk/~brugge/anomt.jpg more places have been mild of late.

I saw a recent video clip where John Hammond went on about the lack of storminess compared with last year. True, if you live in much of Scotland, NW England or N Wales, so it was unfortunate that he showed a picture of a stormy Penzance prom. Not sure when it was taken, but certainly not last November as was implied, when the stongest gust here was just 44mph and there were only 2 days with onshore winds. In fact pointing to an example from SW England was a bad call as Nov 2016 has been a wetter than 2015 across much of the southern half of England. In the SW whilst nothing much happened in November last year, the railway line was washed away in several places this year. He should have pointed to somewhere 'up north'.

Anyway, back to the cold - or rather lack of it.
V. cold Yr Normal Yr.
Penzance 2010 2016
MIN MAX MIN MAX
24/11 2.2 9.1 5.4 12.7
25/11 0.5 6.3 7.6 10.3
26/11 2.1 7.4 7.2 10.1
27/11 0.6 4.2 3.7 9.8
28/11 -4.3! 4.6 5.7 9.7
29/11 -3.8 3.3 3.4 8.0
30/11 -2.0 3.2 0.1 10.7
01/12 -0.6 3.1 1.3 11.5
02/12 -1.5 2.3 2.5 10.4
03/12 -3.0 6.1 7.3 9.7
04/12 -0.7 8.7 8.0 11.4 (at 09:00 today)
05/12 2.8 5.8 9.3 (13.0C looks likely)

Where are people like Lamb & Philip Eden to add a bit of historically perspective when you need them?

I think part of the issue is people now spend so much time gazing into model forecasts, supported by a stream of MetO 'it's going to a cold, cold winter' clips, that actual observations fall into 2nd place. I won't go into a rant about the MetO lack of interest in observations, but if you ask me . .

"Last November" should read November 2015.

Graham

On 05/12/2016 10:23, Graham Easterling wrote:

Where are people like Lamb & Philip Eden to add a bit of historically perspective when you need them?

I think part of the issue is people now spend so much time gazing into model forecasts, supported by a stream of MetO 'it's going to a cold, cold winter' clips, that actual observations fall into 2nd place. I won't go into a rant about the MetO lack of interest in observations, but if you ask me . . .

Graham
Penzance


Unfortunately I don't think we will be hearing from Philip Eden due to
poor health :-(
--
Keith (Southend)
"Weather Home & Abroad"
http://www.southendweather.net
Twitter:@SS9Weatherman

Unfortunately I don't think we will be hearing from Philip Eden due to
poor health :-(
--
Keith (Southend)

Yes I know, very sad. Also we certainly won't be hearing from Lamb, but we do have his legacy.

Lovely big beach yesterday http://www.sennen-cove.com/index.htm it was a good deal windier than it looks, a good F5 easterly. No surf, but that's all set to change now the Alantic's wide awake.

Graham
Penzance

On Monday, 5 December 2016 13:05:48 UTC, Graham Easterling wrote:


Unfortunately I don't think we will be hearing from Philip Eden due to
poor health :-(
--
Keith (Southend)

Yes I know, very sad. Also we certainly won't be hearing from Lamb, but we do have his legacy.

Lovely big beach yesterday http://www.sennen-cove.com
Sen...ove beach?

"Graham Easterling" wrote in message
...
The forecasters have been going on about cold, lack of stormy weather and the like for an
age now.

But it hasn't been that cold has it? I mean, there's been some cold nights, notably in the
Somerset levels & Thames valley, but overall
http://www.met.reading.ac.uk/~brugge/anomt.jpg more places have been mild of late.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Perspective does depend on location Graham and does not
revolve around the south of England. Here we have had a notably
cold spell and the maximum temperature today has been -4C. Already
-7C and as I have to go out to a meeting tonight, I'm not looking
forward to it, it is cold. For you Graham it would be in the 'Ultima
Thule' range.

Phil
40 miles N. of Inverness

On Monday, December 5, 2016 at 5:24:08 PM UTC, philgurr wrote:
"Graham Easterling" wrote in message
...
The forecasters have been going on about cold, lack of stormy weather and the like for an
age now.

But it hasn't been that cold has it? I mean, there's been some cold nights, notably in the
Somerset levels & Thames valley, but overall
http://www.met.reading.ac.uk/~brugge/anomt.jpg more places have been mild of late.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Perspective does depend on location Graham and does not
revolve around the south of England. Here we have had a notably
cold spell and the maximum temperature today has been -4C. Already
-7C and as I have to go out to a meeting tonight, I'm not looking
forward to it, it is cold. For you Graham it would be in the 'Ultima
Thule' range.

Phil
40 miles N. of Inverness

I was talking about variances from the norm. Clearly a cold day in Penzance would not be a cold day in Tideswell or Braemar!

Looking at http://www.met.reading.ac.uk/~brugge/anomt.jpg it does show above average temperatures over most of Scotland so far this month, though I'm aware there have been big variations over small distances due to inversions.

Graham

"Graham Easterling" wrote in message
...
The forecasters have been going on about cold, lack of stormy weather and
the like for an age now.

But it hasn't been that cold has it? I mean, there's been some cold nights,
notably in the Somerset levels & Thames valley, but overall
http://www.met.reading.ac.uk/~brugge/anomt.jpg more places have been mild of
late.

I saw a recent video clip where John Hammond went on about the lack of
storminess compared with last year. True, if you live in much of Scotland,
NW England or N Wales, so it was unfortunate that he showed a picture of a
stormy Penzance prom. Not sure when it was taken, but certainly not last
November as was implied, when the stongest gust here was just 44mph and
there were only 2 days with onshore winds. In fact pointing to an example
from SW England was a bad call as Nov 2016 has been a wetter than 2015
across much of the southern half of England. In the SW whilst nothing much
happened in November last year, the railway line was washed away in several
places this year. He should have pointed to somewhere 'up north'.

Anyway, back to the cold - or rather lack of it.
V. cold Yr Normal Yr.
Penzance 2010 2016
MIN MAX MIN MAX
24/11 2.2 9.1 5.4 12.7
25/11 0.5 6.3 7.6 10.3
26/11 2.1 7.4 7.2 10.1
27/11 0.6 4.2 3.7 9.8
28/11 -4.3! 4.6 5.7 9.7
29/11 -3.8 3.3 3.4 8.0
30/11 -2.0 3.2 0.1 10.7
01/12 -0.6 3.1 1.3 11.5
02/12 -1.5 2.3 2.5 10.4
03/12 -3.0 6.1 7.3 9.7
04/12 -0.7 8.7 8.0 11.4 (at 09:00 today)
05/12 2.8 5.8 9.3 (13.0C looks likely)

Where are people like Lamb & Philip Eden to add a bit of historically
perspective when you need them?

I think part of the issue is people now spend so much time gazing into model
forecasts, supported by a stream of MetO 'it's going to a cold, cold winter'
clips, that actual observations fall into 2nd place. I won't go into a rant
about the MetO lack of interest in observations, but if you ask me . . .

Graham
Penzance
=============

Well it was a cold month up here on Dartmoor (also in the SW). Hard frozen
ground on quite a few days. And there has been a distinct lack of real rain,
just one wet day in November (with over 60mm). Only 168.6mm last month in
total. Philip Eden was not respected in the MetO due to his constant sniping
from the sidelines.

Will
--
" Some sects believe that the world was created 5000 years ago. Another sect
believes that it was created in 1910 "
http://www.lyneside.demon.co.uk/Hayt...antage_Pro.htm
Will Hand (Haytor, Devon, 1017 feet asl)
---------------------------------------------

SNIP
V. cold Yr Normal Yr.
Penzance 2010 2016
MIN MAX MIN MAX
24/11 2.2 9.1 5.4 12.7
25/11 0.5 6.3 7.6 10.3
26/11 2.1 7.4 7.2 10.1
27/11 0.6 4.2 3.7 9.8
28/11 -4.3! 4.6 5.7 9.7
29/11 -3.8 3.3 3.4 8.0
30/11 -2.0 3.2 0.1 10.7
01/12 -0.6 3.1 1.3 11.5
02/12 -1.5 2.3 2.5 10.4
03/12 -3.0 6.1 7.3 9.7
04/12 -0.7 8.7 8.0 11.4 (at 09:00 today)
05/12 2.8 5.8 9.3 (13.0C looks likely)

Where are people like Lamb & Philip Eden to add a bit of historically
perspective when you need them?

.................................................. .

Well it was a cold month up here on Dartmoor (also in the SW). Hard frozen
ground on quite a few days.

Nothing like a real cold month though, bore no relation to 2010 say.

And there has been a distinct lack of real rain,
just one wet day in November (with over 60mm).

But that's significantly more than your wettest day in Philip Hammond's stormy Nov 2015, when your wettest day was 40.8mm according to my COL database.. The railway line was washed away this year, no such issues in Nov. 2015.

My last really wet November was 2009 with 270mm. 2015 just 142.8mm

Philip Eden was not respected in the MetO due to his constant sniping
from the sidelines.

Will
--

I've a lot more respect for Philip Eden than the MetO (as an organisation with their "Who needs people or actual observations when you have so much computing power" attitude.) It was such a different and much more approachable organisation back in the 20th century, often helpful even. I even had people pop around to drop in satellite imagery in those pre broadband days. That's not to say there aren't good people still working in the MetO, but they are disappearing by the day.

Philip supplied me with so much historical data, as well as equipment & friendship.

Graham
Penzance

SNIP

Philip Eden was not respected in the MetO due to his constant sniping
from the sidelines.

Will
--

Nothing wrong with a bit of constructive criticism (a better term than
'sniping'!) provided it is justified, as Philip's almost always was. Until
relatively recently, no-one in the private sector was respected in the Met
Office. Times have changed.


I've a lot more respect for Philip Eden than the MetO (as an organisation
with their "Who needs people or actual observations when you have so much
computing power" attitude.) It was such a different and much more
approachable organisation back in the 20th century, often helpful even. I
even had people pop around to drop in satellite imagery in those pre
broadband days. That's not to say there aren't good people still working in
the MetO, but they are disappearing by the day.

Philip supplied me with so much historical data, as well as equipment &
friendship.

Graham
Penzance

I agree. Philip has always been very generous with his knowledge. Over the
years he must have spent hundreds of hours generating information for
'enthusiasts', all at no charge.


--
Norman Lynagh
Tideswell, Derbyshire
303m a.s.l.
http://peakdistrictweather.org
@TideswellWeathr