According to CNN the Arctic sea-ice loss is now at its 2nd lowest level ever
with still three, or so, weeks to go in the melting season. The record could
still go according to the report...

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/sci....ap/index.html

Joe

As a matter of interest , how many years of data do they have on the ice
thickness and is it statistically significant .
Jim Beam
"JCW" wrote in message
...
According to CNN the Arctic sea-ice loss is now at its 2nd lowest level
ever
with still three, or so, weeks to go in the melting season. The record
could
still go according to the report...

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/sci....ap/index.html

Joe

On Aug 27, 7:59*pm, "jim beam"
wrote:
As a matter of interest , how many years of data do they have *on the ice
thickness and is it statistically significant .
* * * Jim Beam"JCW" wrote in message

...

According to CNN the Arctic sea-ice loss is now at its 2nd lowest level
ever
with still three, or so, weeks to go in the melting season. The record
could
still go according to the report...

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/sci...e.melt.ap/inde...

Joe

The North-West Passage opened for the first time ever recorded last
year. The search for it had been going on since the 16th century.
The edge of the ice had been reported by whalers for almost as long.
Satellites have only been recording the ice extent in detail since the
1970s. Ice thickness cannot yet be achieved by satellite, so the
record of that is sketchy but pretty damning.

This chart shows the progress of ice extent so far this year:
http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/i...timeseries.png

Here is a map that is updated daily with the ice extent.
http://polar.ncep.noaa.gov/seaice/hires/nh.xml
Even the main North West Passage is nearly ice free, Amundsen took the
the smaller more southerly route between the islands, but that took
him thee years, as did the first traverse of the main North West
Passage in 1920s by dog sled!

What is happening now is totally unprecedented, unexpected, unnerving
and uncontrollable :-(

HTH,

Cheers, Alastair.

On Aug 27, 9:49*pm, Alastair wrote:
On Aug 27, 7:59*pm, "jim beam"
wrote:

As a matter of interest , how many years of data do they have *on the ice
thickness and is it statistically significant .
* * * Jim Beam"JCW" wrote in message

...

According to CNN the Arctic sea-ice loss is now at its 2nd lowest level
ever
with still three, or so, weeks to go in the melting season. The record
could
still go according to the report...

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/sci...e.melt.ap/inde....

Joe

The North-West Passage opened for the first time ever recorded last
year. *The search for it had been going on since the 16th century.
The edge of the ice had been reported by whalers for almost as long.
Satellites have only been recording the ice extent in detail since the
1970s. *Ice thickness cannot yet be achieved by satellite, so the
record of that is sketchy but pretty damning.

This chart shows the progress of ice extent so far this year:http://nsidc..org/data/seaice_index/...timeseries.png

Here is a map that is updated daily with the ice extent.http://polar.ncep..noaa.gov/seaice/hires/nh.xml
Even the main North West Passage is nearly ice free, Amundsen took the
the smaller more southerly route between the islands, but that took
him thee years, as did the first traverse of the main North West
Passage in 1920s by dog sled!

What is happening now is totally unprecedented, unexpected, unnerving
and uncontrollable :-(

HTH,

Cheers, Alastair.

Good news then Alastair: Less energy needed for shipping routes. Now
about those sea levels.

On Aug 27, 11:25*pm, wrote:
On Aug 27, 9:49*pm, Alastair wrote:





On Aug 27, 7:59*pm, "jim beam"
wrote:

As a matter of interest , how many years of data do they have *on the ice
thickness and is it statistically significant .
* * * Jim Beam"JCW" wrote in message

...

According to CNN the Arctic sea-ice loss is now at its 2nd lowest level
ever
with still three, or so, weeks to go in the melting season. The record
could
still go according to the report...

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/sci...e.melt.ap/inde...

Joe

The North-West Passage opened for the first time ever recorded last
year. *The search for it had been going on since the 16th century.
The edge of the ice had been reported by whalers for almost as long.
Satellites have only been recording the ice extent in detail since the
1970s. *Ice thickness cannot yet be achieved by satellite, so the
record of that is sketchy but pretty damning.

This chart shows the progress of ice extent so far this year:http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/i...timeseries.png

Here is a map that is updated daily with the ice extent.http://polar.ncep.noaa.gov/seaice/hires/nh.xml
Even the main North West Passage is nearly ice free, Amundsen took the
the smaller more southerly route between the islands, but that took
him thee years, as did the first traverse of the main North West
Passage in 1920s by dog sled!

What is happening now is totally unprecedented, unexpected, unnerving
and uncontrollable :-(

HTH,

Cheers, Alastair.

Good news then Alastair: Less energy needed for shipping routes. Now
about those sea levels.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hi Lawrence,

You'll be pleased to hear that both the North-West and the North-East
(north of Siberia) Passages are now open. See:
http://www.seaice.dk/iwicos/latest/a...b.20080827.gif

Once the Arctic sea ice has gone completely, the Greenland melt should
really speed up, so don't put those gum boots away yet.

Cheers, Alastair.

On Aug 27, 11:52*pm, Alastair wrote:
On Aug 27, 11:25*pm, wrote:





On Aug 27, 9:49*pm, Alastair wrote:

On Aug 27, 7:59*pm, "jim beam"
wrote:

As a matter of interest , how many years of data do they have *on the ice
thickness and is it statistically significant .
* * * Jim Beam"JCW" wrote in message

...

According to CNN the Arctic sea-ice loss is now at its 2nd lowest level
ever
with still three, or so, weeks to go in the melting season. The record
could
still go according to the report...

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/sci...e.melt.ap/inde...

Joe

The North-West Passage opened for the first time ever recorded last
year. *The search for it had been going on since the 16th century.
The edge of the ice had been reported by whalers for almost as long.
Satellites have only been recording the ice extent in detail since the
1970s. *Ice thickness cannot yet be achieved by satellite, so the
record of that is sketchy but pretty damning.

This chart shows the progress of ice extent so far this year:http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/i...timeseries.png

Here is a map that is updated daily with the ice extent.http://polar.ncep.noaa.gov/seaice/hires/nh.xml
Even the main North West Passage is nearly ice free, Amundsen took the
the smaller more southerly route between the islands, but that took
him thee years, as did the first traverse of the main North West
Passage in 1920s by dog sled!

What is happening now is totally unprecedented, unexpected, unnerving
and uncontrollable :-(

HTH,

Cheers, Alastair.

Good news then Alastair: Less energy needed for shipping routes. Now
about those sea levels.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hi Lawrence,

You'll be pleased to hear that both the North-West and the North-East
(north of Siberia) Passages are now open. See:http://www.seaice.dk/iwicos/latest/a...b.20080827.gif

Once the Arctic sea ice has gone completely, the Greenland melt should
really speed up, so don't put those gum boots away yet.

Cheers, Alastair.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

It'll still be close, though I would still not back a record low this
year. 3 weeks to go. warmth to the north of Canada will accentuate
melting there, over the next week, but it looks colder after that.

There is very little evidence, however, that Greenland ice melt would
speed up with no Arctic end of summer ice (that's all we are talking
about Alistair, there will always be winter ice, GW, or not!). Less
ice could mean greater evaporation and more snowfall in areas
surrounding the Arctic (it's a could, I'm not sure if I buy that one).
Thus, Greenland glaciers catchments could receive more snowfall and
thus produce more ice. The timespans in this are likely to be much
longer than human livespans too.

Paul

On Aug 28, 5:18*am, "JCW" wrote:
According to CNN the Arctic sea-ice loss is now at its 2nd lowest level ever
with still three, or so, weeks to go in the melting season. The record could
still go according to the report...

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/sci...e.melt.ap/inde...

Joe

Interesting as only a month or so ago they were not forecasting this.
It is amazing what has happened during the past 8 to 4 weeks.

On Sep 20, 10:57*am, Jellore wrote:
On Aug 28, 5:18*am, "JCW" wrote:

According to CNN the Arctic sea-ice loss is now at its 2nd lowest level ever
with still three, or so, weeks to go in the melting season. The record could
still go according to the report...

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/sci...e.melt.ap/inde...

Joe

Interesting as only a month or so ago they were not forecasting this.
It is amazing what has happened during the past 8 to 4 weeks.

Well now it has changed again. The melt has stopped but the new
refreeze has not stared yet. See:
http://www.ijis.iarc.uaf.edu/en/home/seaice_extent.htm

It just goes to prove that the climate system is chaotic.

Cheers, Alastair.

On Sep 20, 11:57*am, Jellore wrote:
On Aug 28, 5:18*am, "JCW" wrote:

According to CNN the Arctic sea-ice loss is now at its 2nd lowest level ever
with still three, or so, weeks to go in the melting season. The record could
still go according to the report...

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/TECH/sci...e.melt.ap/inde...

Joe

Interesting as only a month or so ago they were not forecasting this.
It is amazing what has happened during the past 8 to 4 weeks.

Joe, I think that report is a couple of weeks out of date! *)). At
this stage and seeing the changes over this last week and what the
NSIDC have said, I'd offer you 50/1 a new low being set in 2008.

Paul

"Dawlish" wrote in message
...
On Sep 20, 11:57 am, Jellore wrote:
On Aug 28, 5:18 am, "JCW" wrote:

According to CNN the Arctic sea-ice loss is now at its 2nd lowest level
ever
with still three, or so, weeks to go in the melting season. The record
could
still go according to the report...

Joe, I think that report is a couple of weeks out of date! *)). At
this stage and seeing the changes over this last week and what the
NSIDC have said, I'd offer you 50/1 a new low being set in 2008.

Paul

Paul, as you'll see from the header I posted started this thread on Aug
28th. You are picking up a reply from Jellore who has only replied to my
original post now.

It's okay though, I forgive you. ;-))

Joe