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Old July 10th 19, 10:11 AM posted to uk.sci.weather
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Default [CC] A new paper on Antarctic sea ice

A paper has just been published in PNAS with the title "A 40-y record reveals gradual Antarctic sea ice increases followed by decreases at rates far exceeding the rates seen in the Arctic". It can be read at: https://www.pnas..org/content/early/.../25/1906556116

Significance

A newly completed 40-y record of satellite observations is used to quantify changes in Antarctic sea ice coverage since the late 1970s. Sea ice spreads over vast areas and has major impacts on the rest of the climate system, reflecting solar radiation and restricting ocean/atmosphere exchanges. The satellite record reveals that a gradual, decades-long overall increase in Antarctic sea ice extents reversed in 2014, with subsequent rates of decrease in 2014–2017 far exceeding the more widely publicized decay rates experienced in the Arctic. The rapid decreases reduced the Antarctic sea ice extents to their lowest values in the 40-y record, both on a yearly average basis (record low in 2017) and on a monthly basis (record low in February 2017).

Enjoy, Alastair.

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Old July 10th 19, 01:59 PM posted to uk.sci.weather
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Default [CC] A new paper on Antarctic sea ice

On 10/07/2019 11:11, Alastair B. McDonald wrote:
A paper has just been published in PNAS with the title "A 40-y record reveals gradual Antarctic sea ice increases followed by decreases at rates far exceeding the rates seen in the Arctic". It can be read at: https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2.../25/1906556116

Significance

A newly completed 40-y record of satellite observations is used to quantify changes in Antarctic sea ice coverage since the late 1970s. Sea ice spreads over vast areas and has major impacts on the rest of the climate system, reflecting solar radiation and restricting ocean/atmosphere exchanges. The satellite record reveals that a gradual, decades-long overall increase in Antarctic sea ice extents reversed in 2014, with subsequent rates of decrease in 2014–2017 far exceeding the more widely publicized decay rates experienced in the Arctic. The rapid decreases reduced the Antarctic sea ice extents to their lowest values in the 40-y record, both on a yearly average basis (record low in 2017) and on a monthly basis (record low in February 2017).

Enjoy, Alastair.



No mention of multi-year ice (MYI) in that paper.
Someone's paper had analysed the relative compositions of arctic ice,
wrt relative amounts of first-year and multi-year ice, MYI was
dispropotionally being lost in the overall total.
Then MYI is more resilient, much more so than just added thickness would
scale, in resisting seasonal break-up.
The proportion of MYI in the Arctic these days is very much less,
leading to the parlous state of the sea-ice extent there.
Is the same effect going on down south as an explanation of rapid decrease.?

--
Monthly public talks on science topics, Hampshire , England
http://diverse.4mg.com/scicaf.htm
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Old July 10th 19, 02:55 PM posted to uk.sci.weather
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Default [CC] A new paper on Antarctic sea ice

On 10/07/2019 14:59, N_Cook wrote:
On 10/07/2019 11:11, Alastair B. McDonald wrote:
A paper has just been published in PNAS with the title "A 40-y record
reveals gradual Antarctic sea ice increases followed by decreases at
rates far exceeding the rates seen in the Arctic". It can be read at:
https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2.../25/1906556116

Significance

A newly completed 40-y record of satellite observations is used to
quantify changes in Antarctic sea ice coverage since the late 1970s.
Sea ice spreads over vast areas and has major impacts on the rest of
the climate system, reflecting solar radiation and restricting
ocean/atmosphere exchanges. The satellite record reveals that a
gradual, decades-long overall increase in Antarctic sea ice extents
reversed in 2014, with subsequent rates of decrease in 2014–2017 far
exceeding the more widely publicized decay rates experienced in the
Arctic. The rapid decreases reduced the Antarctic sea ice extents to
their lowest values in the 40-y record, both on a yearly average basis
(record low in 2017) and on a monthly basis (record low in February
2017).

Enjoy, Alastair.



No mention of multi-year ice (MYI) in that paper.
Someone's paper had analysed the relative compositions of arctic ice,
wrt relative amounts of first-year and multi-year ice, MYI was
dispropotionally being lost in the overall total.
Then MYI is more resilient, much more so than just added thickness would
scale, in resisting seasonal break-up.
The proportion of MYI in the Arctic these days is very much less,
leading to the parlous state of the sea-ice extent there.
Is the same effect going on down south as an explanation of rapid
decrease.?


Much less ice survives the summer in Antarctica than in the Arctic and
so has less bearing on the following season. Here's an article you may
find of interest.
https://www.climate.gov/news-feature...sea-ice-extent

--
Graham P Davis, Bracknell, Berks. Web-site: http://www.scarlet-jade.com/
“Understanding is a three-edged sword. Your side, my side, and the
truth.” [Ambassador Kosh]
Posted via Mozilla Thunderbird on openSUSE Tumbleweed.



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Old July 11th 19, 08:42 AM posted to uk.sci.weather
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Default [CC] A new paper on Antarctic sea ice

On Wednesday, 10 July 2019 15:55:37 UTC+1, Graham P Davis wrote:
On 10/07/2019 14:59, N_Cook wrote:
On 10/07/2019 11:11, Alastair B. McDonald wrote:
A paper has just been published in PNAS with the title "A 40-y record
reveals gradual Antarctic sea ice increases followed by decreases at
rates far exceeding the rates seen in the Arctic". It can be read at:
https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2.../25/1906556116

Significance

A newly completed 40-y record of satellite observations is used to
quantify changes in Antarctic sea ice coverage since the late 1970s.
Sea ice spreads over vast areas and has major impacts on the rest of
the climate system, reflecting solar radiation and restricting
ocean/atmosphere exchanges. The satellite record reveals that a
gradual, decades-long overall increase in Antarctic sea ice extents
reversed in 2014, with subsequent rates of decrease in 2014–2017 far
exceeding the more widely publicized decay rates experienced in the
Arctic. The rapid decreases reduced the Antarctic sea ice extents to
their lowest values in the 40-y record, both on a yearly average basis
(record low in 2017) and on a monthly basis (record low in February
2017).

Enjoy, Alastair.



No mention of multi-year ice (MYI) in that paper.
Someone's paper had analysed the relative compositions of arctic ice,
wrt relative amounts of first-year and multi-year ice, MYI was
dispropotionally being lost in the overall total.
Then MYI is more resilient, much more so than just added thickness would
scale, in resisting seasonal break-up.
The proportion of MYI in the Arctic these days is very much less,
leading to the parlous state of the sea-ice extent there.
Is the same effect going on down south as an explanation of rapid
decrease.?


Much less ice survives the summer in Antarctica than in the Arctic and
so has less bearing on the following season. Here's an article you may
find of interest.
https://www.climate.gov/news-feature...sea-ice-extent

--
Graham P Davis, Bracknell, Berks. Web-site: http://www.scarlet-jade.com/
“Understanding is a three-edged sword. Your side, my side, and the
truth.” [Ambassador Kosh]
Posted via Mozilla Thunderbird on openSUSE Tumbleweed.


I found that article interesting, but it does not explain 1) why the Antarctic ice was increasing while the Arctic sea ice was decreasing, nor 2) why the Antarctic sea ice suddenly started decreasing.
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Old July 11th 19, 02:35 PM posted to uk.sci.weather
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Posts: 1,521
Default [CC] A new paper on Antarctic sea ice

On 11/07/2019 09:42, Alastair B. McDonald wrote:
On Wednesday, 10 July 2019 15:55:37 UTC+1, Graham P Davis wrote:
On 10/07/2019 14:59, N_Cook wrote:
On 10/07/2019 11:11, Alastair B. McDonald wrote:
A paper has just been published in PNAS with the title "A 40-y record
reveals gradual Antarctic sea ice increases followed by decreases at
rates far exceeding the rates seen in the Arctic". It can be read at:
https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2.../25/1906556116

Significance

A newly completed 40-y record of satellite observations is used to
quantify changes in Antarctic sea ice coverage since the late 1970s.
Sea ice spreads over vast areas and has major impacts on the rest of
the climate system, reflecting solar radiation and restricting
ocean/atmosphere exchanges. The satellite record reveals that a
gradual, decades-long overall increase in Antarctic sea ice extents
reversed in 2014, with subsequent rates of decrease in 2014–2017 far
exceeding the more widely publicized decay rates experienced in the
Arctic. The rapid decreases reduced the Antarctic sea ice extents to
their lowest values in the 40-y record, both on a yearly average basis
(record low in 2017) and on a monthly basis (record low in February
2017).

Enjoy, Alastair.



No mention of multi-year ice (MYI) in that paper.
Someone's paper had analysed the relative compositions of arctic ice,
wrt relative amounts of first-year and multi-year ice, MYI was
dispropotionally being lost in the overall total.
Then MYI is more resilient, much more so than just added thickness would
scale, in resisting seasonal break-up.
The proportion of MYI in the Arctic these days is very much less,
leading to the parlous state of the sea-ice extent there.
Is the same effect going on down south as an explanation of rapid
decrease.?


Much less ice survives the summer in Antarctica than in the Arctic and
so has less bearing on the following season. Here's an article you may
find of interest.
https://www.climate.gov/news-feature...sea-ice-extent

--
Graham P Davis, Bracknell, Berks. Web-site: http://www.scarlet-jade.com/
“Understanding is a three-edged sword. Your side, my side, and the
truth.” [Ambassador Kosh]
Posted via Mozilla Thunderbird on openSUSE Tumbleweed.


I found that article interesting, but it does not explain 1) why the Antarctic ice was increasing while the Arctic sea ice was decreasing, nor 2) why the Antarctic sea ice suddenly started decreasing.


As far as the rapid decrease around Antartica , whatever the reason,
should stand out a mile as it is tenfold rate increase over anything
before it. Nothing I've seen stands out that prominently.



--
Monthly public talks on science topics, Hampshire , England
http://diverse.4mg.com/scicaf.htm


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Old July 13th 19, 06:10 PM posted to uk.sci.weather
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Posts: 6,603
Default [CC] A new paper on Antarctic sea ice

On Thursday, 11 July 2019 15:35:09 UTC+1, N_Cook wrote:
On 11/07/2019 09:42, Alastair B. McDonald wrote:
On Wednesday, 10 July 2019 15:55:37 UTC+1, Graham P Davis wrote:
On 10/07/2019 14:59, N_Cook wrote:
On 10/07/2019 11:11, Alastair B. McDonald wrote:
A paper has just been published in PNAS with the title "A 40-y record
reveals gradual Antarctic sea ice increases followed by decreases at
rates far exceeding the rates seen in the Arctic". It can be read at:
https://www.pnas.org/content/early/2.../25/1906556116

Significance

A newly completed 40-y record of satellite observations is used to
quantify changes in Antarctic sea ice coverage since the late 1970s.
Sea ice spreads over vast areas and has major impacts on the rest of
the climate system, reflecting solar radiation and restricting
ocean/atmosphere exchanges. The satellite record reveals that a
gradual, decades-long overall increase in Antarctic sea ice extents
reversed in 2014, with subsequent rates of decrease in 2014–2017 far
exceeding the more widely publicized decay rates experienced in the
Arctic. The rapid decreases reduced the Antarctic sea ice extents to
their lowest values in the 40-y record, both on a yearly average basis
(record low in 2017) and on a monthly basis (record low in February
2017).

Enjoy, Alastair.



No mention of multi-year ice (MYI) in that paper.
Someone's paper had analysed the relative compositions of arctic ice,
wrt relative amounts of first-year and multi-year ice, MYI was
dispropotionally being lost in the overall total.
Then MYI is more resilient, much more so than just added thickness would
scale, in resisting seasonal break-up.
The proportion of MYI in the Arctic these days is very much less,
leading to the parlous state of the sea-ice extent there.
Is the same effect going on down south as an explanation of rapid
decrease.?


Much less ice survives the summer in Antarctica than in the Arctic and
so has less bearing on the following season. Here's an article you may
find of interest.
https://www.climate.gov/news-feature...sea-ice-extent

--
Graham P Davis, Bracknell, Berks. Web-site: http://www.scarlet-jade.com/
“Understanding is a three-edged sword. Your side, my side, and the
truth.” [Ambassador Kosh]
Posted via Mozilla Thunderbird on openSUSE Tumbleweed.


I found that article interesting, but it does not explain 1) why the Antarctic ice was increasing while the Arctic sea ice was decreasing, nor 2) why the Antarctic sea ice suddenly started decreasing.


As far as the rapid decrease around Antartica , whatever the reason,
should stand out a mile as it is tenfold rate increase over anything
before it. Nothing I've seen stands out that prominently.



--
Monthly public talks on science topics, Hampshire , England
http://diverse.4mg.com/scicaf.htm


The way glaciers are tied to earthquakes is obvious. You can shake a basin and the sea level will always return. But ice won't. Once it breaks free it falls to sea level and melts or pours away with the tide. It is always a one way street, whatever and it doesn't take much shaking to develop faults and chasms, relatively minor frequencies are all it needs.

It is for good reason the tides are called their "fetch".


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