Another interesting read:

https://www.carbonbrief.org/atlantic...wed-15-per-cen
t-since-mid-twentieth-century?utm_content=buffer4bc65&utm_medium=social&
utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Just how reliable all the information is I can't say but I am pretty
confident that man-made global warming must result in some significant
climate changes. I suspect that these are probably largely locked into
the system already and we (the human race) will have to find a way of
living with the effects.

--
Norman Lynagh
Tideswell, Derbyshire
303m a.s.l.
https://peakdistrictweather.org
Twitter: @TideswellWeathr

On Friday, April 20, 2018 at 1:02:39 PM UTC+1, Norman Lynagh wrote:
Another interesting read:

https://www.carbonbrief.org/atlantic...wed-15-per-cen
t-since-mid-twentieth-century?utm_content=buffer4bc65&utm_medium=social&
utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Just how reliable all the information is I can't say but I am pretty
confident that man-made global warming must result in some significant
climate changes. I suspect that these are probably largely locked into
the system already and we (the human race) will have to find a way of
living with the effects.

--
Norman Lynagh
Tideswell, Derbyshire
303m a.s.l.
https://peakdistrictweather.org
Twitter: @TideswellWeathr

I think too much is often read into the 'cool' patch in the Atlantic.

The 'pool' first appeared after a prolonged spell of anomalous winds in that area. Often SST anomaly patterns seem to be somewhat self perpetuating.

The most anomalously warm area of ocean (for it's latitude) is off NW Scotland & Norway, and that has been even warmer than normal over most of the last year.

I'd be interested in the other Graham's take on it.

All that is not to say we are not changing the climate in unpredictable ways, I'm sure we are. It's the unpredictability that means we should take great care. Although, as Norman says, we've probably already committed ourselves to significant changes.

Graham
Penzance

On 20/04/18 14:49, Graham Easterling wrote:
On Friday, April 20, 2018 at 1:02:39 PM UTC+1, Norman Lynagh wrote:
Another interesting read:

https://www.carbonbrief.org/atlantic...wed-15-per-cen


t-since-mid-twentieth-century?utm_content=buffer4bc65&utm_medium=social&
utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Just how reliable all the information is I can't say but I am
pretty confident that man-made global warming must result in some
significant climate changes. I suspect that these are probably
largely locked into the system already and we (the human race) will
have to find a way of living with the effects.

-- Norman Lynagh Tideswell, Derbyshire 303m a.s.l.
https://peakdistrictweather.org Twitter: @TideswellWeathr

I think too much is often read into the 'cool' patch in the
Atlantic.

The 'pool' first appeared after a prolonged spell of anomalous winds
in that area. Often SST anomaly patterns seem to be somewhat self
perpetuating.

The most anomalously warm area of ocean (for it's latitude) is off NW
Scotland & Norway, and that has been even warmer than normal over
most of the last year.

I'd be interested in the other Graham's take on it.

All that is not to say we are not changing the climate in
unpredictable ways, I'm sure we are. It's the unpredictability that
means we should take great care. Although, as Norman says, we've
probably already committed ourselves to significant changes.

Graham Penzance


That cold pool has been around for most of the past five years. For a
while, like you, I argued that it was a feature caused by cold winds in
the area but I reckon it's been around too long for that to be the
cause. I'm now thinking it may be due to freshening of the Labrador
Current that is causing it to be less dense in comparison to the only
slightly warmer and more saline waters to the east of the current north
of 50N. Further south,in the area of the Grand Banks, where temperature
contrasts are much greater, the Labrador current is still denser than
the Gulf Stream and North Atlantic Drift and continues to sink below it.
As more melting of the Greenland ice sheet occurs, I suspect that the
Labrador current will tend to sink less and may override the NAD (North
Atlantic Drift), resulting in its disappearance, thus repeating previous
sudden shutdowns.


--
Graham P Davis, Bracknell, Berks. Web-site: http://www.scarlet-jade.com/
"There is nothing more frustrating than playing hide and seek with a
deaf wolf." [Benton Fraser]
OS: Linux [openSUSE Tumbleweed]

On Saturday, April 21, 2018 at 8:43:26 AM UTC+1, Graham P Davis wrote:
On 20/04/18 14:49, Graham Easterling wrote:
On Friday, April 20, 2018 at 1:02:39 PM UTC+1, Norman Lynagh wrote:
Another interesting read:

https://www.carbonbrief.org/atlantic...wed-15-per-cen


t-since-mid-twentieth-century?utm_content=buffer4bc65&utm_medium=social&
utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Just how reliable all the information is I can't say but I am
pretty confident that man-made global warming must result in some
significant climate changes. I suspect that these are probably
largely locked into the system already and we (the human race) will
have to find a way of living with the effects.

-- Norman Lynagh Tideswell, Derbyshire 303m a.s.l.
https://peakdistrictweather.org Twitter: @TideswellWeathr

I think too much is often read into the 'cool' patch in the
Atlantic.

The 'pool' first appeared after a prolonged spell of anomalous winds
in that area. Often SST anomaly patterns seem to be somewhat self
perpetuating.

The most anomalously warm area of ocean (for it's latitude) is off NW
Scotland & Norway, and that has been even warmer than normal over
most of the last year.

I'd be interested in the other Graham's take on it.

All that is not to say we are not changing the climate in
unpredictable ways, I'm sure we are. It's the unpredictability that
means we should take great care. Although, as Norman says, we've
probably already committed ourselves to significant changes.

Graham Penzance


That cold pool has been around for most of the past five years. For a
while, like you, I argued that it was a feature caused by cold winds in
the area but I reckon it's been around too long for that to be the
cause. I'm now thinking it may be due to freshening of the Labrador
Current that is causing it to be less dense in comparison to the only
slightly warmer and more saline waters to the east of the current north
of 50N. Further south,in the area of the Grand Banks, where temperature
contrasts are much greater, the Labrador current is still denser than
the Gulf Stream and North Atlantic Drift and continues to sink below it.
As more melting of the Greenland ice sheet occurs, I suspect that the
Labrador current will tend to sink less and may override the NAD (North
Atlantic Drift), resulting in its disappearance, thus repeating previous
sudden shutdowns.


--
Graham P Davis, Bracknell, Berks. Web-site: http://www.scarlet-jade.com/
"There is nothing more frustrating than playing hide and seek with a
deaf wolf." [Benton Fraser]
OS: Linux [openSUSE Tumbleweed]

Am I right in thinking that the NAD would continue (although below the surface), partly as a result of the coriolis effect. Then wouldn't it surface again at a later stage in it's journey? Though, as you say, it does appear to have shutdown completely in the past.

Best make the best of todays warm sunshine!

Graham
Penzance

On 21/04/18 09:21, Graham Easterling wrote:
On Saturday, April 21, 2018 at 8:43:26 AM UTC+1, Graham P Davis
wrote:
On 20/04/18 14:49, Graham Easterling wrote:
On Friday, April 20, 2018 at 1:02:39 PM UTC+1, Norman Lynagh
wrote:
Another interesting read:

https://www.carbonbrief.org/atlantic...wed-15-per-cen




t-since-mid-twentieth-century?utm_content=buffer4bc65&utm_medium=social&
utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Just how reliable all the information is I can't say but I am
pretty confident that man-made global warming must result in
some significant climate changes. I suspect that these are
probably largely locked into the system already and we (the
human race) will have to find a way of living with the
effects.

-- Norman Lynagh Tideswell, Derbyshire 303m a.s.l.
https://peakdistrictweather.org Twitter: @TideswellWeathr

I think too much is often read into the 'cool' patch in the
Atlantic.

The 'pool' first appeared after a prolonged spell of anomalous
winds in that area. Often SST anomaly patterns seem to be
somewhat self perpetuating.

The most anomalously warm area of ocean (for it's latitude) is
off NW Scotland & Norway, and that has been even warmer than
normal over most of the last year.

I'd be interested in the other Graham's take on it.

All that is not to say we are not changing the climate in
unpredictable ways, I'm sure we are. It's the unpredictability
that means we should take great care. Although, as Norman says,
we've probably already committed ourselves to significant
changes.

Graham Penzance


That cold pool has been around for most of the past five years. For
a while, like you, I argued that it was a feature caused by cold
winds in the area but I reckon it's been around too long for that
to be the cause. I'm now thinking it may be due to freshening of
the Labrador Current that is causing it to be less dense in
comparison to the only slightly warmer and more saline waters to
the east of the current north of 50N. Further south,in the area of
the Grand Banks, where temperature contrasts are much greater, the
Labrador current is still denser than the Gulf Stream and North
Atlantic Drift and continues to sink below it. As more melting of
the Greenland ice sheet occurs, I suspect that the Labrador current
will tend to sink less and may override the NAD (North Atlantic
Drift), resulting in its disappearance, thus repeating previous
sudden shutdowns.


Am I right in thinking that the NAD would continue (although below
the surface), partly as a result of the coriolis effect. Then
wouldn't it surface again at a later stage in it's journey? Though,
as you say, it does appear to have shutdown completely in the past.


Once the NAD began to sink, I'm having trouble imagining the mechanism
by which it would resurface. It would require it to either become less
dense - warm up or become less saline - or to flow under an even denser
current. I can't see either of those scenarios being very likely and my
suspicion is that it would continue sinking and take the place of the
Labrador Current sink.


--
Graham P Davis, Bracknell, Berks. Web-site: http://www.scarlet-jade.com/
"There is nothing more frustrating than playing hide and seek with a
deaf wolf." [Benton Fraser]
OS: Linux [openSUSE Tumbleweed]